Gibbon ’em a hard time
As I said before, we’re all racist now. Our culture has been conditioned to think that things are racist. Just because enough people reach such a consensus. It’s easier than thinking.
Some otherwise smart people buy into this too. MKS says: I’ve always felt the “they did it too” defense should be left in elementary school. But that’s not the defense of the point. The point is that humans and chimpanzees make similar facial expressions. Pointing out that resemblance is not inherently racist. Roger gets it but buys the BS (note: not sure if serious):
George W. Bush Is Not Black
It’s true. He really isn’t. He’s a white guy. That’s why comparing him to a chimpanzee is not the same as comparing First Lady Michelle Obama to a chimpanzee.
Depends on the context. In this case, both people are making unflattering facial expressions that are similar to facial expressions made by a monkey. The difference is one person is black. So, it’s racist.
Without deferring to the bogus cultural conditioning argument or saying that it’s because someone said so or saying it’s offensive to someone else, no one can otherwise say why it’s racist. It’s only racist because the target of the lame joke was black.
Any way, the guy at the center of the controversy got paid err fired.
March 9th, 2010 at 10:48 am
First off, I’d say that regardless of whether the intent was “racist” or not, making fun of the First Lady (or any politician’s wife) is generally in bad taste.
Second, I don’t know whether Walt Baker is “racist,” or just an idiot…but sending out that email to known Democrats and members of the media should’ve raised a red flag somewhere in his head.
The reason why there is a general distaste towards comparing black people to lower primates is that there was a good stretch of time (about 500 years give or take), where the policy of white people was to treat Blacks as lesser humans, or even inhuman, as compared to white people. Many times (probably more in the 20th century) proud racists used the monkey/chimp comparison to attempt to portray black people as lesser/non-humans.
So, yes, in 2010 context completely devoid of knowledge of the history of racism in America or the Southeast…perhaps the monkey comparison is benign. But we don’t live in a vacuum, and the sins of the racist fathers are biting Walt Baker in the ass today.
March 9th, 2010 at 10:50 am
I didn’t say he was smart.
And all you’re doing is parroting the ‘cultural context, everyone says so’ canard.
March 9th, 2010 at 10:58 am
And all you’re doing is parroting the ‘cultural context, everyone says so’ canard.
How is “cultural context” a “canard”? Are you saying that we live in a vacuum…that past has no bearing on the present? That we don’t all live by certain standards and knowledge of what is and isn’t socially acceptable?
By your logic, if the RNC started putting out pictures of the President as Sambo it wouldn’t be a problem because it would only be offensive if you put it in a racist context.
March 9th, 2010 at 10:59 am
Uncle,
You shouldn’t denigrate avians by using the term “parroting” in this context. Besides, haven’t you also figured out that once we are racist (which we all are) we will always be racist (as will our children, grandchildren, and even strangers we never met)?
March 9th, 2010 at 11:05 am
“How is “cultural context” a “canard”?”
Intent. You know, the whole point.
“By your logic, … a racist context.”
That comment is nonsense since you’re describing what is, absent any other info, a racist context.
March 9th, 2010 at 11:12 am
So, portraying someone as a caricature of a black stereotype is racist. Portraying a black person as a monkey, which in the past has been used by racists to caricature black people, is not racist. Got it…
March 9th, 2010 at 11:16 am
If any of you conservatives ever wondered why 90% of blacks don’t vote for Republicans, here’s your answer. When you consistently and repeatedly insult them, then follow it up by dismissing their concerns and grievances as a “canard,” it should come as no surprise whatsoever that they don’t want to give your favorite politicians the time of day.
It is astonishing how block-headed and stubborn y’all can be about this kind of stuff. What possible benefit do you get from digging in your heels about this? I just don’t see the upside for you, politically or intellectually.
March 9th, 2010 at 11:17 am
No, you don’t ‘got it.’ You’re incapable of it or deliberately being obtuse since the answer is in your own question. For instance:
portraying someone as a caricature of a black stereotype
Hmm. I wonder how a black stereotype is racist. Oh yeah, because it’s in the definition. Compared to:
She was not portrayed as a monkey. There was an image of her and a chimpanzee making a similar facial expression and their looks were similar. Other such images of white people warrant no such righteous indignation even though all humans have similar facial expressions as chimps. If someone had photoshopped her as looking like a monkey (the only way i can think now to ‘portray’ her as a monkey) then that’s different and clearly racist.
March 9th, 2010 at 11:19 am
Yes, autoegocrat, everyone should stop thinking and disagreeing and hop right in line. And I’m not trying to get people to vote for me.
“What possible benefit do you get from digging in your heels about this?”
There’s truth and bullshit. This is bullshit. And I don’t care about anyone’s delicate sensibilities. And, frankly, unless we work to challenge the supposed ‘cultural context racism’ canard, racism will lose any real meaning. In many cases, it already has. It’s quickly becoming like fascist and nazi. Just a whipped up political insult to rile people, devoid of any substantive meaning.
March 9th, 2010 at 11:27 am
She was not portrayed as a monkey. There was an image of her and a chimpanzee making a similar facial expression and their looks were similar.
The email that I read said that Tarzan’s chimpanzee, Cheeta, had married a lawyer and moved to the White House. I’m sorry that I could’ve confused this with comparing her to a chimp…my bad, how obtuse of me.
March 9th, 2010 at 11:34 am
“I’m sorry that I could’ve confused this with comparing her to a chimp”
I’m starting to wonder if you understand English. You said something about portrayed as a monkey, which she was not. You did not say ‘compared to’, which she was. The email was also accompanied by an image to set up the lame joke. In the context of the joke, there was a resemblance. Folks are upset about the image. Had he just called her ‘cheeta’ then that would be pretty darn racist.
March 9th, 2010 at 11:57 am
Portray:
1. To depict or represent pictorially; make a picture of.
2. To depict or describe in words.
OK, so he “compared her” to a Chimp, yet “portrayed” her as Cheeta. The combination of the two makes this a thoroughly un-racist and non-controversial email.
Knowing what I know now, how anyone one could’ve taken offense to this email is beyond me.
March 9th, 2010 at 11:58 am
“how anyone could’ve taken”
March 9th, 2010 at 12:11 pm
And we’re back to cultural context again. Circles are fun. Yawn.
March 9th, 2010 at 12:52 pm
How is pointing out something obvious Racist? Noticing that Michelle Obama made a face that a monkey has made is not racist, it’s saying “Look at these two pictures, the subject of the pictures are making similar faces!” It’s in the same boat as screaming racist if you sent out the picture of Michelle Obama and George Bush making the same face because in the past it was said that all blacks deep down wanted to be white.
Just because someone who can do mental gymnastics to make something offensive, doesn’t make it so.
March 9th, 2010 at 1:06 pm
Nate,
It didn’t take mental gymnastics to view this email as racist, it was the initial reaction of most people who saw it. It takes mental gymnastics to declare why comparing the First Lady to a chimp and “portraying” her as Cheeta from Tarzan is a completely fine thing to do.
March 9th, 2010 at 1:07 pm
yeah, nate, initial reaction = truth.
March 9th, 2010 at 1:30 pm
Sean,
At least you are admitting that you didn’t think before you reacted, you just went off of your “initial reaction”.
March 9th, 2010 at 2:23 pm
Nate,
Said no such thing actually. My initial reaction was to not really care until Conservatives started throwing out the oh-so-typical “but liberals did it to Bush” argument that is both not applicable to this case, and rather meaningless.
March 9th, 2010 at 2:40 pm
So because bush was white, its not applicable and meaningless, but because michelle obama is black the EXACT SAME JOKE is racist? It sounds like YOU are being racist, while we are for equal opportunity teasing.
The fact that you came out of your not caring cave and jump to our first ladies defense AFTER us racist conservatives showed our lack of racial bias shows that, at first, you really agreed with us that its not a big deal.
March 9th, 2010 at 2:43 pm
Nate,
Its not applicable because Bush was the President and Michelle Obama is not.
But, lets assume the comparison is apt. The liberals who compared Bush to a Chimp did so to imply that Bush was stupid. What was the implication with Michelle Obama?
March 9th, 2010 at 2:45 pm
Nate,
I don’t think its a big deal because I’m used to seeing and hearing racist jokes. I work in a blue-collar industry in Tennessee, if I got worked up over every racist joke or insult towards Democrats I’d be in a straight-jacket by now. But was it racist? Yes.
March 9th, 2010 at 2:53 pm
So it wouldn’t be racist if they did the same thing with President Obamas face? They are both public figures, who some people think are worthy of ridicule, much like Bush.
March 9th, 2010 at 3:00 pm
Nate,
It still would’ve come off as racist to most people…but at least we would’ve been in the same ballpark if it were a comparison of an attack on the President, as opposed to his wife.
So, for your viewing pleasure…
http://sheikyermami.com/wp-content/uploads/obama-monkey.jpg
March 9th, 2010 at 3:02 pm
Also, more completely not racist comparisons…
http://www.hicktownpress.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/ObamaMonkey.jpg
March 9th, 2010 at 3:57 pm
“Its not applicable because Bush was the President and Michelle Obama is not.”
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHA
gasp for air…
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
I dub they “Hilarious Troll”
March 9th, 2010 at 3:58 pm
Attacks on public figures are fair game. Treating people differently because of their race is, in fact, racist. So by saying that we can make fun of a white public figure with one joke, but it’s not ok to use the same exact joke about another public figure because of race, you are showing preference based on race.
Thats the difference between us, I’m an equal opportunity jokester, whereas you feel all jokes should be put through some sort of odd filter.
March 9th, 2010 at 8:57 pm
It’s not bullshit when you insult someone. If you think it is, then you don’t belong in politics.
March 9th, 2010 at 9:29 pm
I’m not in politics. And it’s bullshit because we’re talking about accusations of racism. Not if your widdle feewings are hurted.
March 9th, 2010 at 10:31 pm
And after 50+ comments on two posts, the moral of the story is, “Racism is whatever the insulted party claims it is.”
But, hey, I am just a spud, so what do I know?
March 10th, 2010 at 2:53 am
Fuck all chimpanzees, or kill the racist little bastards. Who the Hell do they think they are,imitating our first lady?
March 10th, 2010 at 2:53 am
Rich Little?