Do right in the military and get fired
The other biased Washington paper writes:
The JAG, we are told, mistakenly thought the open-tip round was the same as hollow-point ammunition, which is banned. The original open-tip was known as Sierra MatchKing and broke all records for accuracy in the past 30 years.
The difference between the open-tip and the hollow point is that the open tip is a design feature that improves accuracy while the hollow point is designed for increasing damage when it hits a target.
About 10 days ago, the Army JAG in Iraq ordered all snipers to stop using the open-tip 175-grain M118LR bullet, claiming, falsely, it was prohibited. Instead of the open-tip, snipers were forced to take M-60 machine gun rounds out of belts and use them instead.
The order upset quite a few people here and in Iraq who said the JAG ignored the basic principle of every military lawyer that there is a presumption of legality for all issued weapons or ammunition that are made at the military service level at the time they are acquired.
“She forced snipers to use less accurate ammunition, thereby placing U.S. forces and Iraqi civilians at greater risk,” a Pentagon official said of the JAG, who was not identified by name. “And she incorrectly issued an order. JAGs may advise a commander, but they cannot issue orders.”
After Army lawyers were finally alerted to the JAG’s action, the order was lifted and the JAG was notified that the open tip was perfectly legal for use by snipers. However, the reversal was followed by the Army officials’ taking retaliation against a sniper who blew the whistle on the bogus order. The sniper lost his job over a security infraction in reporting the JAG.
The open-tip (hollow points with an opening that is not as wide as a hollow point, I’d imagine) probably has more stopping power than a FMJ round used in M60s. Still, the guys out there risking their lives should have what works and that was denied to them. They knew that and it cost one guy his job.
Update: In comments, persimmon notes that open tip is:
It has a tiny opening in the tip because it is manufactured backwards, from base to tip, rather than from tip to base. The manufacturer recommends against using it for hunting because it lacks expansion properties.
He links to this discussion of open tip ammo. Also, in comments, HL tells us the open tip is a result of the manufacturing process and not to make the rounds more deadly.
January 24th, 2006 at 1:31 am
Wait, we gotta follow the rules when we are fighting non-uniformed irregular troops? Well shouldn’t that preclude using the .50 BMG to snipe at people then?
January 24th, 2006 at 1:42 am
You’re guessing what “open tip” means? You’re bummin’ me out. But you’re right. It has a tiny opening in the tip because it is manufactured backwards, from base to tip, rather than from tip to base. The manufacturer recommends against using it for hunting because it lacks expansion properties. http://www.thegunzone.com/opentip-ammo.html
January 24th, 2006 at 1:42 am
IIRC, the ‘open tip’ bullets in question are simply match grade rounds, namely the Sierra MatchKing. It has nothing to do with damage to the target and everything to do with accuracy-snipers need ammo that is a lot more accurate and consistent that machinegunners do.
The ‘open tip’ is merely a result of something to do with the manufacturing process.
And they’re no longer M60 rounds. They’re M240 rounds.
January 24th, 2006 at 8:58 am
It should also be noted that hollowpoint ammunition is banned under the Geneva convention, but that snipers fall into a special category of personel who aren’t covered by it more because of hurt feelings than any real legal requirement. During almost all wars since the two world wars, snipers captured by enemy personel were routinely put to death or their fingers cut off. Present Army snipers are typically briefed that if they’re captured by enemy personel to expect their own lives to be treated a great deal worse than those of their comrades in arms.
January 24th, 2006 at 9:11 am
Sierra bullets in the M118LR and M852 are both MANUFACTURING hollowpoints. The copper jacket is put on from the tail end of the bullet for MUCH better consistency. The hollowpoint can hardly be called a hollowpoint- it’s more a manufacturing feature.
M118LR uses the 175gr Sierra. M852 uses the 168gr Sierra. Both are military issued 7.62 ammunition, very similar to .308. Everyone I have trained for Iraq/Afganistan has been issued one or the other for training AND in theatre. We shot a buttload of them on the range. They’re good.
Machine gun ammunition, incidentally, is frequently made to MUCH lower standards so that it gets increased dispersion. (Bigger groups) Linked rounds are much worse quality than standard issue rounds.
Civilian NRA Highpower competitors will happily use M118LR and M852. It’s match-grade. No one but a raw beginner will use USGI standard issue rounds in highpower matches, (unless its a JC Garand Match, and you ought to hear the bitching about various mil-surp 30-06.). Only an inexperienced newbie would be foolish enough to use de-linked mil-surp.
M855, the newer 62gr 5.56 ammo is the best standard issue ammo the army ever issued. It’s not up to NRA Highpower standards, though for issue ammo, it’s pretty good.
I heard of a National Guard machine-gun team linking M852 match grade 7.62 ammo for a competition at Camp Robinson a few years ago. Unknown if they won, but at least they KNEW their ammo.
All the USGI Match ammo boxes DO say: “Not for combat use” on them. Personally, I wouldn’t shoot anything else in a M24 than one of the match ammunitions.
The Soviet Sniper rifles, shooting the 7.62X54R don’t shoot nearly as well as they should…because of the lousy ammo. The Chechnyans brought a much better Soviet match-grade ammo with them when they came to Iraq, and those rifles became MUCH deadlier.
Sounds like normal army confusion to me, especially burning the whistleblower.
When you zero your firearm for one ammo….by the way…it’s not zeroed for any OTHER ammunition. Especially when you are shooting precision firearms at a high level. Like sniping.
January 24th, 2006 at 9:16 am
Robert, you posted that as I was updating the post.
persimmon, pretty easy to guess based on the description in the article. I do know a thing or two about guns, ya know. 😉
January 24th, 2006 at 9:39 am
I thought you knew EVERYTHING about guns!
Anyway, good story. It has bureaucratic incompetence and bureaucratic antipathy for honesty at the same time.