Church Shooting Update
Even more stuff:
Shooter killed himself. After he was already full of holes. Gunnies seem upset by that. Not sure why. So fucking what?
The press notes that Jeanne Assam was fired from her job. Gunnies seem upset by that. Not sure why. So fucking what? Reader Helvetix seems to think someone is lying as Jeanne seems to have been merely suspended.
The women say she’s a hero who also has nice hair.
Guav:
And I want to be clear about something here: Gun rights advocates such as myself are not saying that the solution to public shootings is “more guns.” We are not saying that the solution is “let children bring guns to school.” We are not saying that the solution is “arm everyone.” Nobody is talking about adding guns to the population, or “putting more guns on the streets.”
Careful with those matches. They might hit that strawman you just built.
I’m sure that people are pondering this law is a sign things are in we gunnies’ favor:
If you create a gun-free zone, you’re liable for any harm it causes
10 years ago, you’d have never heard of it.
The big thing I see and hear is the concept that Gun Free Zones are useless. Anywhere. Everyone seems to be on the ball that an armed good guy is not the problem and is the only one who will obey the rules anyway.
I have a feeling we’re about to see a significant shift in gun rights. Just a hunch.
I hope. I doubt, now, you could even get traction on a federal gun law.
December 12th, 2007 at 7:07 am
Well as once was pointed out to me, we didn’t have any school shooting’s until the signs went up, with the possible exception of the Texas Clock Tower in 64.
I suppose you could say advertising works
December 12th, 2007 at 10:36 am
It wasn’t that he killed himself, or that she had been fired. It was all in the way it was reported. It seemed to be intended to minimize her heroism and the fact that an armed volunteer stopped his killing spree early and save a lot of lives.
December 12th, 2007 at 12:12 pm
What the anger is about is touched on by Rob K. It is obvious that the impression of citizen self reliance is at odds with the agenda of government and media. Therefore, her actions, courage, and benefit to her fellow citizens must be minimized to prevent people from realizing that the way to security and liberty is through self reliance and not available at all through government fiat.
That realization would weaken the perceived power of the state. Perception in this arena supplies the state with more power than they can legitimately claim. Ergo, the message Ms. Assam’s actions teach must be countered at all costs.
That is the source of the anger.
December 12th, 2007 at 1:10 pm
Regarding the law establishing liability for “gun-free zones” (otherwise known as “unarmed victim zones”) – looks like a great idea, but is there a way we can do some “early voting” (or is it a “preemptive strike”?) on the issue by avoiding those places entirely?
The problem is, right now you don’t know until you arrive at the front door – and stopping the wife & kids from going in at that point is really tough. If we had a localized listing of such danger zones, maybe we could steer both ourselves and our families into patronizing the folks who DON’T endanger their customers.
Now I already know that Costco and Fry’s Electronics prohibit armed self-defense without providing any actual security, while WalMart, Sam’s Club, Sportsman’s Warehouse and Cabela’s do allow CC – but it would be nice to know more. Is there any way we can set up some sort of database of who the good & bad guys are without attracting lawsuits?
December 12th, 2007 at 2:18 pm
“Is there any way we can set up some sort of database of who the good & bad guys are without attracting lawsuits?”
Now that’s a good question but I dont think we’d have to worry about lawsuits. The reason why is that it’s a safety issue, no different than asking if the business has fire alarms.
December 12th, 2007 at 2:57 pm
Most of the state-by-state pro-carry sites have lists.
Here are a few I know:
http://www.missouricarry.com
http://www.ksccw.com
http://www.iowacarry.com
http://www.coloradocarry.com (I think that’s the correct URL)
December 12th, 2007 at 3:06 pm
Darn it – http://www.iowacarry.org
(But at least I was right on the Colorado URL)
December 12th, 2007 at 3:08 pm
Well, I wouldn’t create the DB as a boycott site but rather as a service to CCW permit holders. A service that helps them plan their shopping and travels while respecting the business owner’s gun bans. Should the CCW permit holder decide to avoid the business rather than leave their gun at home, well it’s a free country.
As for the businesses, they might not want to give up gunnies as customers. The following refers to hunters but I’d bet CCW permit holders have the same characteristics:
“To most sophisticates, hunters may seem to be a slovenly, snaggletoothed bunch who spend what little they have on cheap beer and camouflage. But surprisingly, the average credit score of a Cabela’s credit-card holder exceeds 750, and more than $120 billion was spent in 2006 by more than 87 million Americans (aged 16 and over) on hunting, fishing and outdoor pursuits.” Barron’s
December 12th, 2007 at 5:49 pm
“Gunnies seem upset by that. Not sure why.”
Me neither. Lots of bad guys (Columbine, Cho, one of the North Hollywood guys) off themselves when they know the tables are turned. In this case it was a citizen rather than a cop who turned the tables. She’s still a hero even if her bullet isn’t the one that did him in.
December 12th, 2007 at 6:42 pm
What is the problem? This is textbook. Jeanne Assam was certain he was a menace, walked towards him while firing and commanding “surrender”.
What else is relevant?
December 12th, 2007 at 10:09 pm
KCSteve: Most of the state-by-state pro-carry sites have lists.
From the Virginia Citizens Defense Deague
December 12th, 2007 at 11:44 pm
Sometimes I think I’m talking to children.
December 13th, 2007 at 1:43 am
KCSteve, the only one of the sites you mention that seems to have a list is the Missouri one, and also the Virginia one that Clint provided. I live in AZ, and I haven’t found anything for here (yet) – tho I’d love to find one. Naturally, stores with nationwide policies wouldn’t have to be local (I note that Costco shows up everywhere).
I’ll keep looking – the fact that they DO exist some places is encouraging, though.