Ammo For Sale

« « Lurched into it | Home | The safe from John Wick » »

Changes to form 4473

A look by Guy Sagi. Serial numbers up toward the top now and adding non-binary to the sex selection.

7 Responses to “Changes to form 4473”

  1. tincankilla Says:

    the non-binary thing is a hoot. they’re conflating sex with gender, for one, and by wading into the gender junk, they’re opening up a huge problem with integrity on the form.

    what if i was a man when i signed one then non-binary when i signed another, but then i was really mistaken then and now i’m back to being a man? did i commit a felony?

  2. Tim Says:

    Exactly. The non-binary BS sounds like a legal trap.

  3. HSR47 Says:

    Aside from the issues of putting politics on the form, I have numerous practical concerns with the new draft:

    1: Reformatting the whole form is going to be a huge PITA–I work behind the counter, and the reformatting is going to cause all sorts of problems for us in terms of customers fucking things up. With the current form, it’s possible to minimize this because our instructions (e.g. fill out JUST the front of this form) can be minimal. Now we’re going to have to give much more complicated instructions, and we’re going to have to watch people like hawks for much more of the process. that’s going to be colossal PITA.

    2: IMO, the optimal number of gun lines on the form is 5, which is what the last version of the form had. the current version has 4, and now they’re planning to cut it down to 3. That’s going to be a colossal PITA, because we’re going to need to do extra paperwork on a much more regular basis.

    3: Changing the size/shape of the license info box is going to be a PITA, because it means we’ll have to get a new stamp just for these forms.

    4: It removes the bold emphasis from certain of the “are you a prohibited person” questions. That’s one of the better things that they did on the current version of the form.

    5: They’re planning to screw up the non-immigrant alien questions again. The problem with the current form is that they don’t give CLEAR instructions to people who answer NO on 12.d.1 about what they should do on 12.d.2–All they really need to do is add a line to 12.d.1 that says “if you answer no to this question, check the “N/A” box for 12.d.2″. That would mirror the instructions for the previous version of the form, where the form instructed people to skip the “do you have the extra paperwork” question if they weren’t non-immigrant aliens.

    The only two good things they’re doing here are:

    A: They’re creating a new suplimental form to use when you need more firearm description lines–previously the procedure was to just use additional copies of page 3 (The page in the 4473 with the firearm description lines) until you had enough lines. This will be helpful for transfers that involve an abnormally large number of firearms.

    B: They’re resizing the boxes in the firearm description lines so that the model field is significantly wider. If you’ve ever had to squeeze things like “M&P 380 shield ez” or longer examples into the current box, you’ll appreciate this change too (I generally have to squeeze two lines of text into the current box for a lot of guns).

  4. JOE Says:

    Non-Binary? So having a mental disorder is no longer a disqualifier? Good to hear… now I can finally openly admit that I identify as the Queen of England.

  5. Old Windways Says:

    My understanding of the non-binary addition was that several states have started offering more than just male/female on state-issued IDs (including driver licenses and LTCs). The concern was that if your ID says one thing, and you are forced to answer something else on the 4473, what kind of legal limbo have we entered into?

    This is all 3rd hand knowledge, so I may be mistaken on the rationale.

    Honestly, I don’t care what gender identity a person has when purchasing a firearm as long as they are not a dangerous felon.

  6. Mikee Says:

    I filled out my last 4473 on the ATF online system, which I was assured not only doesn’t care if I abbreviate Texas to TX, but which is definitely, absolutely, really, truly, pinky swear, not being maintained as a database that is in any way, shape, or form even remotely like a firearm registration list. Even though the data can be reviewed for months after purchase. Hmm.

  7. Matt Says:

    IIRC, The non binary and trans people have the highest rate of suicide in the country by a pretty large margin.

    Also, the form already has a political question: “white or non-white hispanic”