BATF has ruled .223, 6.5 Grendel and 6.8SPC cartridges are now pistol cartridges?
So reports the proprietor of Elite Tactical Ammunition. I searched for a ruling on this and cannot find one. However, the president of the company states that the ATF SWAT Team showed up with a search warrant and told him that.
Interesting, if true.
July 11th, 2011 at 4:58 pm
I would love to see the justification on that.
July 11th, 2011 at 5:01 pm
Odd. I wonder if this will affect XM855 at all.
July 11th, 2011 at 5:16 pm
I thought that .223 was ruled a pistol cartridge years ago. Back in the Bushmaster pistol days.
July 11th, 2011 at 5:17 pm
ATF, bringing the stupid since 1972.
July 11th, 2011 at 5:24 pm
So, does this mean that the millions of rounds of .223 in circulation are now illegal?
July 11th, 2011 at 5:25 pm
“under the radar.”
July 11th, 2011 at 5:26 pm
I hope they can get them back before they send them to Mexico!
July 11th, 2011 at 5:42 pm
No ATL, they’re collecting them so they CAN send them to Mexico…
July 11th, 2011 at 5:46 pm
@wizardpc:
Yes, and you (and most of us) are criminals now.
So it begins. We really need to get rid of the ATF and replace it with, NOTHING.
July 11th, 2011 at 6:19 pm
Finally. The other shoe has dropped on this.
Now we have the perfect opportunity to seek legislative reform of the definition of “pistol caliber” and define .308, 7.62×39 and .223 non-pistol ammo.
July 11th, 2011 at 6:33 pm
wizard: No.
At most it’d mean that solid hard metal .223 ammo would be prohibited.
(18 USC 921 – which I assume is the “68 GAC” reference the link above references, despite that being a later amendment (1986) and not in the Gun Control Act itself – defines “armor piercing ammunition” as ammunition that:
“may be used in a handgun” [including eg. a Thompson/Center contender…] and has a bullet that “is constructed entirely […] from one or a combination of tungsten alloys, steel, iron, brass, bronze, beryllium copper, or depleted uranium”
OR has
“a fully jacketed projectile larger than .22 caliber designed and intended for use in a handgun and whose jacket has a weight of more than 25 percent of the total weight of the projectile”.)
Given that .223 pistols are not a new thing, .223 solid-hard-metal (anything but lead or soft copper, really) or the like projectiles should have been banned as AP since 1986.
(There’s a lot of talk about SS109 being “exempted”, but since it is not a solid-metal projectile, and is NOT larger than .22, that doesn’t make a lot of sense.
It’s “exempted” in the sense that the definitions never covered it in the first place…)
July 11th, 2011 at 6:35 pm
@ Sigivald
We need to get rid of that stupid law.
July 11th, 2011 at 6:36 pm
@Stigvald:
“(18 USC 921 – which I assume is the “68 GAC” reference the link above references, despite that being a later amendment (1986) and not in the Gun Control Act itself – defines “armor piercing ammunition” as ammunition that:
“may be used in a handgun” [including eg. a Thompson/Center contender…] and has a bullet that “is constructed entirely […] from one or a combination of tungsten alloys, steel, iron, brass, bronze, beryllium copper, or depleted uranium””
Um, does this mean 00 still shot, shot from a .410 is illegal?
July 11th, 2011 at 6:36 pm
steel, not stil
July 11th, 2011 at 7:46 pm
Meh… this is interesting, I’m beginning to wonder if this is tied into the upcoming gun control laws that are being put in place by E.O…
July 11th, 2011 at 10:23 pm
Shootin’ Buddy, you won’t get any legislation passed that appears to weaken restrictions on the faux “armor piercing” ammunition.
July 11th, 2011 at 10:25 pm
BTW, note the conflict between these regulations and lead bullet restrictions in California et al.
July 11th, 2011 at 10:46 pm
‘We need to get rid of that stupid law.”
WHAT? And let all those C..c..c..COOOPPP KKKIIILLLER bullets flood on the streets to maim, mutilate, kill, and generally PO off people?
Are you serious! There will be BLOOD ON THE STREETS. DODGE CITY!
You might even force the bad guys to just bring rifles.
July 12th, 2011 at 7:11 am
That’s a wonderful opportunity for us, if true, to get large chunks of the various GCA voided for vagueness, actually.
July 12th, 2011 at 8:59 am
So now the ATF SWAT are message boys? I guess the ATF doesn’t have mail service, telephones, or e-mail.
July 12th, 2011 at 9:48 am
OS: Have you tried conversing with the BATFE? That back and forth could take years. They might actually have to walk mail down to the mailroom!
(I was once told by an agent that it would take about 3 weeks to get a letter, from his desk, to the mail room. Having worked on projects involving the building in question, I know the mailroom isnt that far away.)
July 12th, 2011 at 10:30 am
wizardpc,
Military surplus M855 5.56 ball and military surplus M2 “Black Tip” .30-’06 ball enjoy special exemptions.
July 12th, 2011 at 1:41 pm
Great! I can just see the signs at the Gun Show Now : “ATF Banning 5.56 Ammo! Buy NOW before it disappears! Only $2.00 a Round!” Then its 2008-2009 all over again. Thanks ATF!
July 12th, 2011 at 2:07 pm
Elite is tiny. Probably has few legal resources to throw at this.
Nosler, Hornady, and Barnes all make similar bullets from gilding metal/brass. If Elite is guilty of wrong doing, so are they.
Elite may be a “canary in the coal mine” test of the shooting communities reaction to more restriction.