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Saiga Update

From Coal Creek Armory on facebook:

We are hearing that the importer of the Saiga 12 shotguns has ceased importation while waiting for the official ruling by the ATF. There are a limited number of these firearms already in the pipeline for distribution and we will be getting as many as available to us just as soon as they are available. Call now – 865-966-4545 – if you would like to be put on the list.

I never really wanted a Saiga. Until now.

27 Responses to “Saiga Update”

  1. Exodus Says:

    OK I’m confused. Even if the ATF moved forward with their plan (right now they’re merely considering it) wouldn’t a bog stock Saiga 12, as imported, still meet the reqs?

    IIRC, the Saiga 12 hasn’t been actively produced in a while now, and maybe the pipeline is running dry.

  2. Middle Man Says:

    Russian American Armory lost the contract to import Saigas back in the fall. Izhmash is setting up their own US based import operation in Florida currently.

  3. Exodus Says:

    Wait, box mag is ONE evil feature and that’s all it takes to ban importation. Sorry, yeah it looks like the S12 would be “eeevil” if the new regs are implemented.

  4. Maxpwr Says:

    Exodus,

    The list of features in the ATF report is:

    (1) Folding, telescoping, or collapsible stocks;
    (2) bayonet lugs;
    (3) flash suppressors;
    (4) magazines over 5 rounds, or a drum magazine;
    (5) grenade-launcher mounts;
    (6) integrated rail systems (other than on top of the receiver or barrel);
    (7) light enhancing devices;
    (8) excessive weight (greater than 10 pounds for 12 gauge or smaller);
    (9) excessive bulk (greater than 3 inches in width and/or greater than 4 inches in depth);
    (10) forward pistol grips or other protruding parts designed or used for gripping the
    shotgun with the shooter’s extended hand.

    Unless I missed something, I don’t see box magazine as being one of the features, as long as it holds 5 rounds or less (maybe 4+1 chamber??).

  5. Paul Says:

    And so are they saying those ‘features’ above have caused crime? Didn’t know rails did that, or lights, or excessive weight???? So bulky guns are bad?

    This list is just BS and has nothing to do with stopping crime (but we know that!) Once the Saiga is made in the U.S. it will have any and all of these features. So it’s just ATF being stuck on stupid.

  6. Chad Says:

    Kinda like what happened to the AR15….the assault weapons ban started, and then everybody wanted one.

  7. Mr Evilwrench Says:

    Examine the investment portfolios of the principals behind the ruling, hmm?

  8. DaveY Says:

    There is no reason whatsoever to cease importing now. ATF hasn’t taken any action and any action they would take wouldn’t affect a distributor or importer. EVEN if you accept that there would be impact, there won’t be any action until after 1 May, 2011.

    Smells like profiteering.

  9. Bobby Says:

    DaveY, What if there is a total ban. No retailer wants to spend money on unsellable goods.

  10. Sigivald Says:

    Paul: No, they’re saying those features are not suitable for a “sporting purpose”, which is there in the law from 1968.

    Bobby: A total ban isn’t even being considered, as far as anyone knows – and was just as possible (unlikely in the extreme) five years ago as today.

    Me, I think that the worst this means is that someone will just start making AK-pattern shotguns in the US – then there’s no import hoops at all.

    And that people should push for amendments or selective repeal of the Gun Control Act.

  11. Stuart the Viking Says:

    The “Sporting Purpose” language of the 1968 law is entirely too vague and that SHOULD be enough to invalidate it. However, as we all know, what SHOULD be and what is are two creatures that rarely meet.

    s

  12. Exodus Says:

    Crap, I saw “removeable magazines” in the Outdoor Wire report from Jim Shepherd.

    Now I have to RTWT from ATF as punishment. Dang it.

  13. Laurence Blount Says:

    Dead Gummit! I wish they would stop saying poop like this before a gun show weekend. I bravely passed on an S12 last time after the Shot Show scare. I don’t know if I can do that this time.

    Ugly. Doesn’t fit me. Heavy. Not a Shotgun person. But dang it… Now I want one!

  14. Shootin' Buddy Says:

    Form 6s were being held up as early as November ’10.

  15. Mad Saint Jack Says:

    If Izhmash is smart they will find a way to “make” S-12s in the US.

  16. Some Guy Says:

    Saiga 12s are garbage, anyways. All the quality of an AKM pattern receiver without any of the reliability. I’ve seen three of them, up close and personal, and none of them could feed and function through two full magazines (one of them couldn’t get through one). The one guy I know who owns one, now, spends more time trying to “fix” the thing than shooting it.

  17. Mad Saint Jack Says:

    Can anyone clarify if we are talking about the importation of S-12s, or all Saiga shotguns, or all Saigas (Shotguns & Rifles)???

  18. Stuart the Viking Says:

    I believe it would be all Saiga shotguns except the .410s since the “Sporting Purpose” rule in question has to do with shotguns with a bore of over a half inch.

    s

  19. Ron W Says:

    I’ve got a Saiga .308 rifle. It would seem that it is a much better weapon than the Saiga shotgun. Of course, it can be used for “sporting purposes” like target practice I suppose, but I have it for use as a counter-assault rifle, that is, to counter the crime or the tactic of assault. The “sporting purpose” of target practice would be to enhance the primary reason for having the rifle.

  20. Kevin Says:

    There are a lot of what the Saiga-12 forum calls “Vodka Specials” out there, with poor QC etc. It’s a lot like buying a 1911, the first thing you do is send it to a gunsmith to work on it and make it work reliably. Though in most cases this also includes reworking it out if the “sporting” configuration.

    But yeah, I have a few more on the way.

  21. Linoge Says:

    *sigh* It sucks that my budget makes me choose between “what I want” and “what they are going to ban/restrict/regulate/etc.”

    The latter should never be a concern…

  22. Diomed Says:

    If ATF had any juice they’d just ask State to withhold approval to import. Form 6 denials can be appealed. State Department refusals can’t (unless you’re buds with Hillary or Barack). Just one of the reasons I have respect for importers but think they’re crazy – ATF is actually the most reasonable agency they deal with.

  23. **** Says:

    I for one, have wanted a semi-auto evil black 12 gauge for quite some time.

  24. Chas Says:

    The Second Amendment supersedes; the Gun Control Act of ’68 is unconstitutional in that it denies Americans access to firearms that are consistent with the Second Amendment.

  25. Exodus Says:

    Chas I believe that to be exactly the case myself.

  26. Diomed Says:

    It’s not us you have to convince, it’s the federal court system. Good luck with that.

  27. Justthisguy Says:

    I always wanted a Saiga, since I first heard that they existed. With a coupla drum magazines. Eff the nonsense about the Zombie Threat, it’s the live humans who are dangerous.