Thanks to diminishing returns, they only have to be marginally better. If I average driving 250 miles a week, increasing the fuel efficiency of my Mariner from 20 to 25mpg saves as much gas as increasing the fuel efficiency of a Civic from 35mpg to 55mpg

As for the “smug”, I’m always surprised that conservative types aren’t interested in saving money. It sure is nice driving by gas stations advertising $3.10 gas and watching the MPG meter show 52MPG.

Probably not that nice, though, if you did a full calculation of how much more you had to pay for the hybrid in the first place.

Does nobody here care about the claim that Bill Haslam is a member of Mayors Against Guns?

Regarding caring about it, I’m the guy that broke the story.

It is not a claim. It is a fact. Haslam has unwittingly remained a member.

I get 26 MPG highway on my 2000 de Ville.

Very expensive though. VERY. I was surprised at the bottom-end power on it.

Anything with grunt is going to come with a hefty price tag. It’s those CAFE standards that make a manufacture sell a bunch of econo-boxes for every land cruising yacht

If you’re willing to wade through a pretty long post, this does a pretty good job of explaining at least part of the appeal of SUVs.

Teaser quote:

…
The CAFE — Corporate Average Fuel Economy — standards require that the cars that a manufacturer sells attain a certain average fuel mileage. Obviously, this is a problem if you are Cadillac, and in the business of selling large and powerful cars to people who don’t particularly care about fuel economy.

However, if your vehicle is a truck, you have to meet a different, less stringent, standard. So we wind up with the SUV, which is basically a station wagon built on a ‘truck’ chassis. What’s a truck? The EPA says:…

The uncle clan needs a vehicle that seats four and, since my convertible days are done, we also like having a truck. I kinda wish honda would come out with a fuel efficient ridgeline.

You should consider the Highlander. We looked at one (family of 5) and it was plenty roomy. Very expensive though. VERY. I was surprised at the bottom-end power on it. I’ve said it elsewhere: If GM or Ford would say “Gas only engines will be premium options on all of our models starting in 2013″, I’d buy Ford at 5.96 a share. But they won’t. They don’t have the balls. This isn’t about engineering smarts, it’s about balls. They are afraid the stock holders will punish them. Notice to Ford especially, you’ve been punished. Nothing to lose. The worse thing that could happen is that Ford gets bought up by some Chinese conglomerate, which will happen anyway.

The uncle clan needs a vehicle that seats four and, since my convertible days are done, we also like having a truck. I kinda wish honda would come out with a fuel efficient ridgeline.

the “smug” is a south park reference.

And it’s not really about the money. It’s about doing my part to get the US less dependent on oil, really.

The Prius and Civic are the MPG kings, though, and the others are only marginally better than their standard versions. And yes, the Prius is ugly, but it grows on you plus it can haul a lot of junk.

(GM has a couple of new ones, too, but they mostly aren’t available and don’t get much better mileage than the regular versions and worse mileage than some other vehicles in their lineup.)

As for the “smug”, I’m always surprised that conservative types aren’t interested in saving money. It sure is nice driving by gas stations advertising $3.10 gas and watching the MPG meter show 52MPG.

I don’t know how much more the Prius cost than the regular version because there isn’t one, but it’s similar in price to a similarly equipped Camry, and it’s the least expensive car we’ve bought in over 15 years.

Oh, and thanks to all you taxpayers for the tax credit I’m getting this year. It’s much appreciated.

Wind it up too much?

metulj, I thought for sure you would get a hard on with the Fiat 500. What gives?

Remember, you are the one who needs Viagra.

I had a Cinquecento when I lived in Rome for a year. Great car. It blew up coming back from Ancona. We put a sign in the window that said, “Threw a rod. You can have it” and hitched back to our place.

If you are buying any other car than a Bugatti as an “investment,” you are crazy. I’ve got some ARM loans to sell. Are you interested in those as well?

Two quibbles:
1.) The hybrid comes with all the bells and whistles, so you can’t compare it to the base model of the fuel-only version. If you compare it to a similarly equipped fuel-only verson, the price difference is only $3000
2.) You’re also forgetting the close to $2,000 federal income tax rebate you get for the mariner hybrid

The hybrid mariner is, according to mercury.com, about $6000 more than the 4cy and gets 7mpg better. At $3/gal, you have to drive it 151000 miles before you’ve ‘saved’ any money. At $4, its 116000.

Of course, that doesn’t include taxes, insurance, and finance charges incurred because of the larger price tag.

If you’re buying a car to save money on gas, buy an $800 dodge neon. its what I did.

You are most likely making a bad investment if you buy a Hybrid. They’re usually several thousand $$$ above the price of a comparable non-hybrid, so over the life of the car, say 100-150K miles you’re not going to recoup that extra money you spent via fuel savings.

Besides, you can get damn good gas mileage in your basic Toyota Corolla / Honda Civic as long as you don’t have a lead foot.

As in most things, many are, but not all.

VW Passat diesel for a little more room.

Why are those vehicles always so ugly?

I asked the same thing when we were looking at the Prius. After a year, I do love my Prius. 50 mpg most of the time. Have had it up to around 58 mpg and down to oh so bad 48 mpg.

Wanted a hatchback so the Honda Civic and Camry were not an option. Wanted excellent gas mileage so the Toyota Highlander Hybrid was out. Plus the Highlander is quite expensive.

Now want either a Ford Escape hybrid or the Mercury Mariner hybrid as a second car for more people/cargo. So far can’t find one in East Tennessee. There are very few in the South East U.S.

Oh, and liberal bumper stickers are not necessary on the Prius, it is assumed.

To look politically correct, and to amaze people whom I leave in the dust at the light, I have purchased from Ebay a genunine Ford badge that says “hybrid” and have affixed same next to the V6 badge.

Consarn the consternation it causes.

Al Czervic
Editor
The Catskill Commentator
http://www.commentator.vze.com

My hybrid (a Mercury Mariner) looks exactly like the fuel-only version of the same vehicle. But then I’m apparently one of the few people who bought a hybrid purely to save money.

Most hybrid owners aren’t interested in saving money or the environment; they do it to assert their moral superiority over the people around them. If that’s your main goal, owning a hyrbid is useless unless everyone KNOWS it’s a hybrid.

10-4, I hear that.

What to see some real MPG?

And they handle like a sports car. No batteries to bury, and no SMUG.

I think I will get one just to blow the doors off the hippie mobiles.

Remember kids, hippies are not your friends.

Stop, logic hurts…

Yep, it really is the HOV thingy around here. What? you didn’t her that from the press? Nor treehugger? I’m not surprised.

The newer hybrids also aren’t always that more fuel effeciant The big appeal for say a hybrid pick-up, in addition to the HOV thingy, is that they can build them with some 110v. AC plugs. Great for construction workers. Also handy for rolling blackouts. Yes, California, land of rolling blackouts, has draconian restrictions on the emissions of backup generators. Enter the “hybrid loophole”. Heh.

Remember kids, always hate hypocrites.

Again, let the original buyer pay the “green” premium, and buy used.

Stop, logic hurts…

Of course, the irony at least here in the DC area is that by riding in the HOV lanes, they aren’t using the cars in a way that’s actually benefiting from the increased miles per gallon. They would be better off stuck in traffic with me in the main lines.

When you look at the increased initial costs (keep in mind that initial cost is a good indicator of the resources that went into it’s production), none of the current crop of green vehicles make much sense from an economic standpoint – you’re lucky to break even over the life of the car. Battery technology from a natural resource perspective (nickel mining), or environmental perspective(acids and heavy metals) are none too green. In most areas, the only practical reason to own one is all about circumventing the HOV restrictions.

If you really want to save the environment, or your own hard earned cash, buy a small, light, fuel efficient used (nothing more production efficient than a car that already exists) car, and keep the engine and exhaust in proper running order. If you must buy new, then a small diesel from VW (or someone else) is a better real-world bet than any of the other options.

Once the incentive for a fast ride evaporates, I expect the bottom to fall out of the smug market. The 04 and later Prius is quite hackable, and the battery pack is made of standard AA NiMH, so it ought to be rebuildable by someone who knows what end of a soldering iron to hold. Bonus, Toyota builds all their engines without the stealth self-destruct feature every other automaker does – meaning, if the timing belt happens to break, you don’t need a rebuilt head or replacement piston.

Besides, I need something to replace my much battered Camry, (and I’ve had another hit-and-run since then).

On my 8mgpg lifted Bronco

I think the Prius is more aerodynamic than your Miata. The shape they chose for the Prius is excellent from an aerodynamic point of view.

So true.

In fact there is a video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7T_KGHubIGo

Don’t tell the Prius owners about the smug, they’ll deny it and try to explain the ugly body style on aerodynamics. My Miata is aerodynamic and beautiful, a Prius is just ugly. But it does have the fishbowl affect so everyone can see you’re a wonderful person.

How many Priuses (Prii?) have you seen with “Kerry/Edwards” or “Re-elect Al Gore” bumper stickers? In Tucson, it’s a LOT.

So basically, it’s because some people aren’t secure enough in actually reducing their fuel demands, they have to scream it to the world with the distinct design.